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EUTHYPHRO
By Plato
Translated by Benjamin Jowett
Contents
INTRODUCTION.
In the Meno, Anytus had parted from Socrates with the significant words: 'That in any city, and particularly in the city of Athens, it is easier to do men harm than to do them good;' and Socrates was anticipating another opportunity of talking with him. In the Euthyphro, Socrates is awaiting his trial for impiety. But before the trial begins, Plato would like to put the world on their trial, and convince them of ignorance in that very matter touching which Socrates is accused. An incident which may perhaps really have occurred in the family of Euthyphro, a learned Athenian diviner and soothsayer, furnishes the occasion of the discussion.
In the Meno, Anytus left Socrates with the important remark: 'In any city, especially in Athens, it’s easier to harm people than to help them;' and Socrates was looking forward to another chance to talk to him. In the Euthyphro, Socrates is waiting for his trial for impiety. But before the trial starts, Plato wants to put society on trial and prove that they are ignorant about the very issue for which Socrates is being accused. An incident that may have actually happened in Euthyphro's family, who is a knowledgeable Athenian diviner and soothsayer, sparks the discussion.
This Euthyphro and Socrates are represented as meeting in the porch of the King Archon. (Compare Theaet.) Both have legal business in hand. Socrates is defendant in a suit for impiety which Meletus has brought against him (it is remarked by the way that he is not a likely man himself to have brought a suit against another); and Euthyphro too is plaintiff in an action for murder, which he has brought against his own father. The latter has originated in the following manner:—A poor dependant of the family had slain one of their domestic slaves in Naxos. The guilty person was bound and thrown into a ditch by the command of Euthyphro's father, who sent to the interpreters of religion at Athens to ask what should be done with him. Before the messenger came back the criminal had died from hunger and exposure.
This Euthyphro and Socrates are shown meeting on the porch of the King Archon. (See Theaet.) Both have legal matters to attend to. Socrates is the defendant in a lawsuit for impiety that Meletus has brought against him (it's noted, by the way, that he doesn’t seem like the type to bring a lawsuit against anyone); and Euthyphro is also the plaintiff in a murder charge against his own father. This situation came about as follows: A poor dependent of the family had killed one of their household slaves in Naxos. The culprit was bound and thrown into a ditch by Euthyphro's father, who sent a messenger to the religious interpreters in Athens to ask what should be done with him. Before the messenger returned, the criminal died from hunger and exposure.
This is the origin of the charge of murder which Euthyphro brings against his father. Socrates is confident that before he could have undertaken the responsibility of such a prosecution, he must have been perfectly informed of the nature of piety and impiety; and as he is going to be tried for impiety himself, he thinks that he cannot do better than learn of Euthyphro (who will be admitted by everybody, including the judges, to be an unimpeachable authority) what piety is, and what is impiety. What then is piety?
This is where Euthyphro's murder charge against his father comes from. Socrates is sure that before Euthyphro could have taken on the responsibility of such a case, he must have had a solid understanding of what piety and impiety really mean. Since Socrates himself is about to be tried for impiety, he thinks it would be best to learn from Euthyphro—who everyone, including the judges, will recognize as an unquestionable expert—about what piety is and what impiety is. So, what is piety?
Euthyphro, who, in the abundance of his knowledge, is very willing to undertake all the responsibility, replies: That piety is doing as I do, prosecuting your father (if he is guilty) on a charge of murder; doing as the gods do—as Zeus did to Cronos, and Cronos to Uranus.
Euthyphro, confident in his knowledge, eagerly takes on all the responsibility and responds: Piety is doing what I’m doing, prosecuting your father (if he’s guilty) for murder; it’s acting like the gods do—like Zeus did to Cronos, and Cronos did to Uranus.
Socrates has a dislike to these tales of mythology, and he fancies that this dislike of his may be the reason why he is charged with impiety. 'Are they really true?' 'Yes, they are;' and Euthyphro will gladly tell Socrates some more of them. But Socrates would like first of all to have a more satisfactory answer to the question, 'What is piety?' 'Doing as I do, charging a father with murder,' may be a single instance of piety, but can hardly be regarded as a general definition.
Socrates dislikes these myths and thinks that this dislike might be why people accuse him of being impious. "Are they really true?" "Yes, they are," and Euthyphro is happy to share more of them with Socrates. However, Socrates wants a clearer answer to the question, "What is piety?" "Doing what I do, accusing a father of murder," may be one example of piety, but it's not a good overall definition.
Euthyphro replies, that 'Piety is what is dear to the gods, and impiety is what is not dear to them.' But may there not be differences of opinion, as among men, so also among the gods? Especially, about good and evil, which have no fixed rule; and these are precisely the sort of differences which give rise to quarrels. And therefore what may be dear to one god may not be dear to another, and the same action may be both pious and impious; e.g. your chastisement of your father, Euthyphro, may be dear or pleasing to Zeus (who inflicted a similar chastisement on his own father), but not equally pleasing to Cronos or Uranus (who suffered at the hands of their sons).
Euthyphro responds that "Piety is what the gods love, and impiety is what they do not love." But could there not be differing opinions, just like among humans, also among the gods? Especially regarding good and evil, which have no set guidelines; these are exactly the kinds of disagreements that lead to conflicts. Thus, what one god loves may not be loved by another, and the same action can be both pious and impious; for example, your punishment of your father, Euthyphro, might please Zeus (who did something similar to his own father), but it may not be equally pleasing to Cronos or Uranus (who were harmed by their sons).
Euthyphro answers that there is no difference of opinion, either among gods or men, as to the propriety of punishing a murderer. Yes, rejoins Socrates, when they know him to be a murderer; but you are assuming the point at issue. If all the circumstances of the case are considered, are you able to show that your father was guilty of murder, or that all the gods are agreed in approving of our prosecution of him? And must you not allow that what is hated by one god may be liked by another? Waiving this last, however, Socrates proposes to amend the definition, and say that 'what all the gods love is pious, and what they all hate is impious.' To this Euthyphro agrees.
Euthyphro replies that there’s no disagreement, either among gods or people, about whether it’s right to punish a murderer. Yes, Socrates counters, when they recognize him as a murderer; but you're taking that for granted. If you examine all the details of the case, can you prove that your father committed murder, or that all the gods support prosecuting him? And shouldn’t you consider that what one god hates might be favored by another? Setting that aside, Socrates suggests we tweak the definition to say that 'what all the gods love is pious, and what they all hate is impious.' Euthyphro agrees with this.
Socrates proceeds to analyze the new form of the definition. He shows that in other cases the act precedes the state; e.g. the act of being carried, loved, etc. precedes the state of being carried, loved, etc., and therefore that which is dear to the gods is dear to the gods because it is first loved of them, not loved of them because it is dear to them. But the pious or holy is loved by the gods because it is pious or holy, which is equivalent to saying, that it is loved by them because it is dear to them. Here then appears to be a contradiction,—Euthyphro has been giving an attribute or accident of piety only, and not the essence. Euthyphro acknowledges himself that his explanations seem to walk away or go round in a circle, like the moving figures of Daedalus, the ancestor of Socrates, who has communicated his art to his descendants.
Socrates starts to break down the new way of defining things. He points out that, in other situations, the action comes before the state; for instance, being carried, loved, etc. happens before the state of being carried, loved, etc. This means that whatever is dear to the gods is dear to them because it is first loved by them, not that it is loved by them because it is already dear to them. However, the pious or holy is loved by the gods because it is pious or holy, which basically means that it is loved by them because it is dear to them. This creates a contradiction—Euthyphro has only been offering a trait or characteristic of piety, not its true essence. Euthyphro himself admits that his explanations seem to circle back on themselves, like the moving figures of Daedalus, Socrates' ancestor, who passed his skills down to his descendants.
Socrates, who is desirous of stimulating the indolent intelligence of Euthyphro, raises the question in another manner: 'Is all the pious just?' 'Yes.' 'Is all the just pious?' 'No.' 'Then what part of justice is piety?' Euthyphro replies that piety is that part of justice which 'attends' to the gods, as there is another part of justice which 'attends' to men. But what is the meaning of 'attending' to the gods? The word 'attending,' when applied to dogs, horses, and men, implies that in some way they are made better. But how do pious or holy acts make the gods any better? Euthyphro explains that he means by pious acts, acts of service or ministration. Yes; but the ministrations of the husbandman, the physician, and the builder have an end. To what end do we serve the gods, and what do we help them to accomplish? Euthyphro replies, that all these difficult questions cannot be resolved in a short time; and he would rather say simply that piety is knowing how to please the gods in word and deed, by prayers and sacrifices. In other words, says Socrates, piety is 'a science of asking and giving'—asking what we want and giving what they want; in short, a mode of doing business between gods and men. But although they are the givers of all good, how can we give them any good in return? 'Nay, but we give them honour.' Then we give them not what is beneficial, but what is pleasing or dear to them; and this is the point which has been already disproved.
Socrates, wanting to provoke Euthyphro's lazy thinking, asks the question differently: 'Is everything pious just?' 'Yes.' 'Is everything just pious?' 'No.' 'Then what part of justice is piety?' Euthyphro answers that piety is the part of justice that 'deals' with the gods, while there's another part that 'deals' with humans. But what does it mean to 'deal' with the gods? The term 'dealing,' when used for dogs, horses, and humans, suggests it makes them better in some way. But how do pious or holy actions improve the gods? Euthyphro clarifies that by pious acts, he means acts of service or helping. True, but the work of a farmer, doctor, or builder has a purpose. What purpose do we serve the gods, and what do we help them achieve? Euthyphro responds that all these tough questions can't be answered quickly; he'd rather say simply that piety is about knowing how to please the gods through words and actions like prayers and sacrifices. In other words, Socrates says, piety is 'a way of asking and giving'—asking for what we want and giving them what they want; basically, a way of doing business between gods and humans. But even though they give all good things, how can we offer them anything good in return? 'Well, we give them honor.' So we’re not giving them what’s useful, but what pleases or is dear to them; and this is the very point that has already been shown to be false.
Socrates, although weary of the subterfuges and evasions of Euthyphro, remains unshaken in his conviction that he must know the nature of piety, or he would never have prosecuted his old father. He is still hoping that he will condescend to instruct him. But Euthyphro is in a hurry and cannot stay. And Socrates' last hope of knowing the nature of piety before he is prosecuted for impiety has disappeared. As in the Euthydemus the irony is carried on to the end.
Socrates, though tired of Euthyphro's tricks and dodges, is still firm in his belief that he needs to understand the essence of piety, or else he wouldn't have taken legal action against his own father. He still hopes that Euthyphro will agree to teach him. But Euthyphro is in a rush and can’t stick around. Socrates’ last chance to learn about the nature of piety before facing charges of impiety is gone. Just like in the Euthydemus, the irony continues until the end.
The Euthyphro is manifestly designed to contrast the real nature of piety and impiety with the popular conceptions of them. But when the popular conceptions of them have been overthrown, Socrates does not offer any definition of his own: as in the Laches and Lysis, he prepares the way for an answer to the question which he has raised; but true to his own character, refuses to answer himself.
The Euthyphro clearly aims to highlight the true nature of piety and impiety compared to popular beliefs about them. However, once these popular beliefs are challenged, Socrates doesn’t provide his own definition. Similar to the Laches and Lysis, he sets the stage for an answer to the question he has brought up, but, staying true to his own nature, he refuses to answer it himself.
Euthyphro is a religionist, and is elsewhere spoken of, if he be the same person, as the author of a philosophy of names, by whose 'prancing steeds' Socrates in the Cratylus is carried away. He has the conceit and self-confidence of a Sophist; no doubt that he is right in prosecuting his father has ever entered into his mind. Like a Sophist too, he is incapable either of framing a general definition or of following the course of an argument. His wrong-headedness, one-sidedness, narrowness, positiveness, are characteristic of his priestly office. His failure to apprehend an argument may be compared to a similar defect which is observable in the rhapsode Ion. But he is not a bad man, and he is friendly to Socrates, whose familiar sign he recognizes with interest. Though unable to follow him he is very willing to be led by him, and eagerly catches at any suggestion which saves him from the trouble of thinking. Moreover he is the enemy of Meletus, who, as he says, is availing himself of the popular dislike to innovations in religion in order to injure Socrates; at the same time he is amusingly confident that he has weapons in his own armoury which would be more than a match for him. He is quite sincere in his prosecution of his father, who has accidentally been guilty of homicide, and is not wholly free from blame. To purge away the crime appears to him in the light of a duty, whoever may be the criminal.
Euthyphro is a religious person and is mentioned elsewhere, if he’s the same individual, as the originator of a philosophy about names, through which Socrates in the Cratylus is swept away. He has the arrogance and confidence of a Sophist; he never doubts that he’s right in prosecuting his father. Like a Sophist, he also struggles to create a general definition or follow a logical argument. His stubbornness, narrow-mindedness, and certainty are typical of his priestly role. His inability to grasp an argument can be compared to a similar flaw seen in the rhapsode Ion. However, he isn't a bad person and has a friendly attitude toward Socrates, recognizing his familiar sign with interest. Even though he can’t fully understand him, he is eager to be guided by him and readily seizes any idea that saves him the effort of thinking. Moreover, he opposes Meletus, who, as he claims, is exploiting the public's dislike for changes in religion to harm Socrates; at the same time, he amusingly believes he has tools in his own arsenal that would defeat him. He is genuinely sincere in prosecuting his father, who has unintentionally committed homicide and is not entirely blameless. To him, cleansing the crime feels like a duty, no matter who the offender may be.
Thus begins the contrast between the religion of the letter, or of the narrow and unenlightened conscience, and the higher notion of religion which Socrates vainly endeavours to elicit from him. 'Piety is doing as I do' is the idea of religion which first occurs to him, and to many others who do not say what they think with equal frankness. For men are not easily persuaded that any other religion is better than their own; or that other nations, e.g. the Greeks in the time of Socrates, were equally serious in their religious beliefs and difficulties. The chief difference between us and them is, that they were slowly learning what we are in process of forgetting. Greek mythology hardly admitted of the distinction between accidental homicide and murder: that the pollution of blood was the same in both cases is also the feeling of the Athenian diviner. He had not as yet learned the lesson, which philosophy was teaching, that Homer and Hesiod, if not banished from the state, or whipped out of the assembly, as Heracleitus more rudely proposed, at any rate were not to be appealed to as authorities in religion; and he is ready to defend his conduct by the examples of the gods. These are the very tales which Socrates cannot abide; and his dislike of them, as he suspects, has branded him with the reputation of impiety. Here is one answer to the question, 'Why Socrates was put to death,' suggested by the way. Another is conveyed in the words, 'The Athenians do not care about any man being thought wise until he begins to make other men wise; and then for some reason or other they are angry:' which may be said to be the rule of popular toleration in most other countries, and not at Athens only. In the course of the argument Socrates remarks that the controversial nature of morals and religion arises out of the difficulty of verifying them. There is no measure or standard to which they can be referred.
Thus begins the contrast between the religion of the written law, or the narrow and unthinking conscience, and the higher idea of religion that Socrates tries to bring out. 'Piety is doing what I do' is the notion of religion that first comes to mind for him, as well as for many others who may not express their thoughts as openly. People are not easily convinced that any other religion is better than theirs; or that other nations, like the Greeks during Socrates' time, took their religious beliefs and challenges as seriously. The main difference between us and them is that they were slowly learning what we are in the process of forgetting. Greek mythology barely recognized the distinction between accidental killing and murder: the idea that the taint of blood was the same in both situations is also held by the Athenian priest. He had not yet grasped the lesson that philosophy was teaching, which was that Homer and Hesiod, if not completely rejected from the state, or driven out of the assembly as Heracleitus more harshly suggested, were at least not to be relied upon as authorities in religion; and he is ready to defend his actions with examples from the gods. These are the very stories that Socrates detests; and his aversion to them, as he suspects, has marked him with the label of impiety. This provides one answer to the question, 'Why was Socrates put to death?' suggested as a side note. Another reason is reflected in the statement, 'The Athenians don't care about anyone being considered wise until he starts to make others wise; and then, for some reason, they get angry:' which could be seen as the general rule of public tolerance in most other places, not just Athens. During the discussion, Socrates notes that the contentious nature of morals and religion comes from the difficulty in proving them. There is no measure or standard to which they can be compared.
The next definition, 'Piety is that which is loved of the gods,' is shipwrecked on a refined distinction between the state and the act, corresponding respectively to the adjective (philon) and the participle (philoumenon), or rather perhaps to the participle and the verb (philoumenon and phileitai). The act is prior to the state (as in Aristotle the energeia precedes the dunamis); and the state of being loved is preceded by the act of being loved. But piety or holiness is preceded by the act of being pious, not by the act of being loved; and therefore piety and the state of being loved are different. Through such subtleties of dialectic Socrates is working his way into a deeper region of thought and feeling. He means to say that the words 'loved of the gods' express an attribute only, and not the essence of piety.
The next definition, 'Piety is what the gods love,' gets stuck on a subtle difference between the state and the action, which corresponds to the adjective (philon) and the participle (philoumenon), or maybe to the participle and the verb (philoumenon and phileitai). The action comes before the state (like how in Aristotle, energeia comes before dunamis); and being loved is preceded by the act of loving. But piety or holiness comes from the act of being pious, not from the act of being loved; so, piety and the state of being loved are not the same. Through these elegant distinctions, Socrates is diving deeper into thought and feeling. He means to say that the phrase 'loved by the gods' describes an attribute only, not the essence of piety.
Then follows the third and last definition, 'Piety is a part of justice.' Thus far Socrates has proceeded in placing religion on a moral foundation. He is seeking to realize the harmony of religion and morality, which the great poets Aeschylus, Sophocles, and Pindar had unconsciously anticipated, and which is the universal want of all men. To this the soothsayer adds the ceremonial element, 'attending upon the gods.' When further interrogated by Socrates as to the nature of this 'attention to the gods,' he replies, that piety is an affair of business, a science of giving and asking, and the like. Socrates points out the anthropomorphism of these notions, (compare Symp.; Republic; Politicus.) But when we expect him to go on and show that the true service of the gods is the service of the spirit and the co-operation with them in all things true and good, he stops short; this was a lesson which the soothsayer could not have been made to understand, and which every one must learn for himself.
Then comes the third and final definition, 'Piety is a part of justice.' So far, Socrates has worked to establish religion on a moral foundation. He is trying to achieve a balance between religion and morality, which the great poets Aeschylus, Sophocles, and Pindar had unintentionally anticipated, and which is a universal need for all people. To this, the soothsayer adds the ceremonial aspect, 'attending to the gods.' When Socrates further questions him about what this 'attention to the gods' means, he responds that piety is a matter of business, a skill in giving and asking, and so on. Socrates points out the anthropomorphism in these ideas (see Symposium; Republic; Politicus). But just when we expect him to continue and demonstrate that the true service of the gods involves serving the spirit and working with them in everything true and good, he suddenly stops; this was a lesson that the soothsayer would not have been able to grasp, and which each person must learn for themselves.
There seem to be altogether three aims or interests in this little Dialogue: (1) the dialectical development of the idea of piety; (2) the antithesis of true and false religion, which is carried to a certain extent only; (3) the defence of Socrates.
There appear to be three main goals or interests in this short Dialogue: (1) the dialectical exploration of the concept of piety; (2) the contrast between true and false religion, although it's developed to some extent only; (3) the defense of Socrates.
The subtle connection with the Apology and the Crito; the holding back of the conclusion, as in the Charmides, Lysis, Laches, Protagoras, and other Dialogues; the deep insight into the religious world; the dramatic power and play of the two characters; the inimitable irony, are reasons for believing that the Euthyphro is a genuine Platonic writing. The spirit in which the popular representations of mythology are denounced recalls Republic II. The virtue of piety has been already mentioned as one of five in the Protagoras, but is not reckoned among the four cardinal virtues of Republic IV. The figure of Daedalus has occurred in the Meno; that of Proteus in the Euthydemus and Io. The kingly science has already appeared in the Euthydemus, and will reappear in the Republic and Statesman. But neither from these nor any other indications of similarity or difference, and still less from arguments respecting the suitableness of this little work to aid Socrates at the time of his trial or the reverse, can any evidence of the date be obtained.
The subtle connection with the Apology and the Crito; the withholding of the conclusion, like in the Charmides, Lysis, Laches, Protagoras, and other Dialogues; the deep insight into the religious realm; the dramatic tension and interplay between the two characters; the unmatched irony—these are all reasons to believe that the Euthyphro is an authentic Platonic text. The way the popular portrayals of mythology are criticized is reminiscent of Republic II. Piety has already been identified as one of five virtues in the Protagoras, but it doesn’t count among the four cardinal virtues in Republic IV. The figure of Daedalus appears in the Meno; that of Proteus in the Euthydemus and Io. The royal science has already been introduced in the Euthydemus and will show up again in the Republic and Statesman. However, from these or any other signs of similarity or difference, and even less from discussions about how suitable this small work is to help Socrates during his trial or not, no evidence about the date can be determined.
EUTHYPHRO
PERSONS OF THE DIALOGUE: Socrates, Euthyphro.
PERSONS OF THE DIALOGUE: Socrates, Euthyphro.
SCENE: The Porch of the King Archon.
SCENE: The King Archon's Patio.
EUTHYPHRO: Why have you left the Lyceum, Socrates? and what are you doing in the Porch of the King Archon? Surely you cannot be concerned in a suit before the King, like myself?
EUTHYPHRO: Why did you leave the Lyceum, Socrates? What are you doing at the Porch of the King Archon? You can’t be involved in a case before the King, can you?
SOCRATES: Not in a suit, Euthyphro; impeachment is the word which the Athenians use.
SOCRATES: Not in a suit, Euthyphro; impeachment is the term that the Athenians use.
EUTHYPHRO: What! I suppose that some one has been prosecuting you, for I cannot believe that you are the prosecutor of another.
EUTHYPHRO: What! I guess someone has been taking legal action against you, because I can’t believe you’re the one prosecuting someone else.
SOCRATES: Certainly not.
SOCRATES: Definitely not.
EUTHYPHRO: Then some one else has been prosecuting you?
EUTHYPHRO: So someone else has been taking you to court?
SOCRATES: Yes.
SOCRATES: Yeah.
EUTHYPHRO: And who is he?
EUTHYPHRO: Who is he?
SOCRATES: A young man who is little known, Euthyphro; and I hardly know him: his name is Meletus, and he is of the deme of Pitthis. Perhaps you may remember his appearance; he has a beak, and long straight hair, and a beard which is ill grown.
SOCRATES: Euthyphro, there’s a young guy I don’t know well; his name is Meletus, and he’s from the deme of Pitthis. You might recall what he looks like; he has a beak-like nose, long straight hair, and a scruffy beard.
EUTHYPHRO: No, I do not remember him, Socrates. But what is the charge which he brings against you?
EUTHYPHRO: No, I don’t remember him, Socrates. But what’s the charge he’s bringing against you?
SOCRATES: What is the charge? Well, a very serious charge, which shows a good deal of character in the young man, and for which he is certainly not to be despised. He says he knows how the youth are corrupted and who are their corruptors. I fancy that he must be a wise man, and seeing that I am the reverse of a wise man, he has found me out, and is going to accuse me of corrupting his young friends. And of this our mother the state is to be the judge. Of all our political men he is the only one who seems to me to begin in the right way, with the cultivation of virtue in youth; like a good husbandman, he makes the young shoots his first care, and clears away us who are the destroyers of them. This is only the first step; he will afterwards attend to the elder branches; and if he goes on as he has begun, he will be a very great public benefactor.
SOCRATES: What’s the accusation? It’s a very serious one that really reveals a lot about this young man, and it’s not something to overlook. He claims to understand how young people are led astray and who’s responsible for it. I think he must be wise, and since I’m the opposite of wise, he has figured me out and plans to accuse me of corrupting his young friends. The state will serve as the judge in this matter. Among all our political leaders, he’s the only one who seems to start off on the right path by focusing on developing virtue in young people; like a good farmer, he prioritizes nurturing the young plants and removing those who would harm them. This is just the beginning; he’ll also address the older branches later, and if he continues as he has started, he will become a significant public benefactor.
EUTHYPHRO: I hope that he may; but I rather fear, Socrates, that the opposite will turn out to be the truth. My opinion is that in attacking you he is simply aiming a blow at the foundation of the state. But in what way does he say that you corrupt the young?
EUTHYPHRO: I hope he does, but I’m worried, Socrates, that the opposite is true. I believe that by going after you, he’s really targeting the very foundation of our society. But how does he claim that you’re corrupting the youth?
SOCRATES: He brings a wonderful accusation against me, which at first hearing excites surprise: he says that I am a poet or maker of gods, and that I invent new gods and deny the existence of old ones; this is the ground of his indictment.
SOCRATES: He makes a pretty amazing accusation against me that, at first glance, is surprising: he claims that I am a poet or creator of gods, and that I come up with new gods and reject the old ones; this is the basis of his indictment.
EUTHYPHRO: I understand, Socrates; he means to attack you about the familiar sign which occasionally, as you say, comes to you. He thinks that you are a neologian, and he is going to have you up before the court for this. He knows that such a charge is readily received by the world, as I myself know too well; for when I speak in the assembly about divine things, and foretell the future to them, they laugh at me and think me a madman. Yet every word that I say is true. But they are jealous of us all; and we must be brave and go at them.
EUTHYPHRO: I get it, Socrates; he wants to go after you about that familiar sign that occasionally, as you say, shows up for you. He thinks you’re a trendy philosopher, and he plans to take you to court over it. He knows that people are quick to believe such accusations, just as I know all too well; because when I talk in the assembly about divine matters and predict the future, they mock me and think I’m crazy. But everything I say is true. Still, they are jealous of all of us; and we need to be brave and confront them.
SOCRATES: Their laughter, friend Euthyphro, is not a matter of much consequence. For a man may be thought wise; but the Athenians, I suspect, do not much trouble themselves about him until he begins to impart his wisdom to others, and then for some reason or other, perhaps, as you say, from jealousy, they are angry.
SOCRATES: Their laughter, friend Euthyphro, doesn't really mean much. A person might be seen as wise, but I suspect the Athenians don’t pay much attention to him until he starts sharing his wisdom with others. At that point, for some reason—maybe, as you say, out of jealousy—they get upset.
EUTHYPHRO: I am never likely to try their temper in this way.
EUTHYPHRO: I'm probably not going to test their patience like this.
SOCRATES: I dare say not, for you are reserved in your behaviour, and seldom impart your wisdom. But I have a benevolent habit of pouring out myself to everybody, and would even pay for a listener, and I am afraid that the Athenians may think me too talkative. Now if, as I was saying, they would only laugh at me, as you say that they laugh at you, the time might pass gaily enough in the court; but perhaps they may be in earnest, and then what the end will be you soothsayers only can predict.
SOCRATES: I don’t think that’s true, because you’re pretty reserved and rarely share your knowledge. But I have this friendly habit of opening up to everyone, and I’d even pay for someone to listen to me. I worry that the people of Athens might find me too chatty. Now, if they would just laugh at me like you say they laugh at you, we could enjoy our time in court. But maybe they’re serious, and only you fortune tellers can predict what will happen next.
EUTHYPHRO: I dare say that the affair will end in nothing, Socrates, and that you will win your cause; and I think that I shall win my own.
EUTHYPHRO: I honestly believe that this situation will lead to nothing, Socrates, and that you’ll win your case; and I think I’ll win mine too.
SOCRATES: And what is your suit, Euthyphro? are you the pursuer or the defendant?
SOCRATES: So what’s your situation, Euthyphro? Are you the one taking action or the one being accused?
EUTHYPHRO: I am the pursuer.
EUTHYPHRO: I'm the pursuer.
SOCRATES: Of whom?
SOCRATES: Who are you talking about?
EUTHYPHRO: You will think me mad when I tell you.
EUTHYPHRO: You’re going to think I’m crazy when I tell you.
SOCRATES: Why, has the fugitive wings?
SOCRATES: Why, does the fugitive have wings?
EUTHYPHRO: Nay, he is not very volatile at his time of life.
EUTHYPHRO: No, he's not very changeable at this stage of his life.
SOCRATES: Who is he?
SOCRATES: Who’s he?
EUTHYPHRO: My father.
My dad.
SOCRATES: Your father! my good man?
SOCRATES: Your father! Really, my friend?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: And of what is he accused?
SOCRATES: What is he being accused of?
EUTHYPHRO: Of murder, Socrates.
Murder, Socrates.
SOCRATES: By the powers, Euthyphro! how little does the common herd know of the nature of right and truth. A man must be an extraordinary man, and have made great strides in wisdom, before he could have seen his way to bring such an action.
SOCRATES: By the gods, Euthyphro! how little the average person understands the nature of right and truth. A person has to be truly exceptional and have advanced significantly in wisdom to have the clarity to take such an action.
EUTHYPHRO: Indeed, Socrates, he must.
EUTHYPHRO: Absolutely, Socrates, he must.
SOCRATES: I suppose that the man whom your father murdered was one of your relatives—clearly he was; for if he had been a stranger you would never have thought of prosecuting him.
SOCRATES: I guess that the guy your dad killed was a relative of yours—obviously he was; because if he had been a stranger, you would never have considered taking him to court.
EUTHYPHRO: I am amused, Socrates, at your making a distinction between one who is a relation and one who is not a relation; for surely the pollution is the same in either case, if you knowingly associate with the murderer when you ought to clear yourself and him by proceeding against him. The real question is whether the murdered man has been justly slain. If justly, then your duty is to let the matter alone; but if unjustly, then even if the murderer lives under the same roof with you and eats at the same table, proceed against him. Now the man who is dead was a poor dependant of mine who worked for us as a field labourer on our farm in Naxos, and one day in a fit of drunken passion he got into a quarrel with one of our domestic servants and slew him. My father bound him hand and foot and threw him into a ditch, and then sent to Athens to ask of a diviner what he should do with him. Meanwhile he never attended to him and took no care about him, for he regarded him as a murderer; and thought that no great harm would be done even if he did die. Now this was just what happened. For such was the effect of cold and hunger and chains upon him, that before the messenger returned from the diviner, he was dead. And my father and family are angry with me for taking the part of the murderer and prosecuting my father. They say that he did not kill him, and that if he did, the dead man was but a murderer, and I ought not to take any notice, for that a son is impious who prosecutes a father. Which shows, Socrates, how little they know what the gods think about piety and impiety.
EUTHYPHRO: I'm amused, Socrates, by your distinction between someone who is related to you and someone who isn't. The wrongdoing is the same either way if you knowingly associate with the murderer when you should be distancing yourself from him and taking action. The real question is whether the murder was justified. If it was justified, then you should leave it alone; but if it was unjustified, then even if the murderer lives with you and shares your meals, you should take action against him. The deceased was a poor worker of mine who helped out on our farm in Naxos. One day, in a drunken rage, he got into a fight with one of our household servants and killed him. My father tied him up and threw him into a ditch, then sent a messenger to Athens to ask a seer what to do next. In the meantime, he ignored him and didn’t care for him, believing him to be a murderer and thinking that it wouldn’t be a big deal if he died. That’s exactly what happened. The cold, hunger, and chains took their toll on him, and before the messenger returned from the seer, he was dead. Now my father and family are upset with me for supporting the murderer and taking legal action against my father. They insist that he didn't kill him, and even if he did, the dead man was just a murderer, so I shouldn't do anything about it because a son who prosecutes his father is acting impiously. This shows, Socrates, how little they understand what the gods truly think about piety and impiety.
SOCRATES: Good heavens, Euthyphro! and is your knowledge of religion and of things pious and impious so very exact, that, supposing the circumstances to be as you state them, you are not afraid lest you too may be doing an impious thing in bringing an action against your father?
SOCRATES: Wow, Euthyphro! Are you so sure about your understanding of religion and what’s right and wrong that, assuming everything is as you say, you’re not worried that you might also be doing something wrong by suing your father?
EUTHYPHRO: The best of Euthyphro, and that which distinguishes him, Socrates, from other men, is his exact knowledge of all such matters. What should I be good for without it?
EUTHYPHRO: The best thing about Euthyphro, and what sets him apart, Socrates, is his precise understanding of all these issues. What would I be without that?
SOCRATES: Rare friend! I think that I cannot do better than be your disciple. Then before the trial with Meletus comes on I shall challenge him, and say that I have always had a great interest in religious questions, and now, as he charges me with rash imaginations and innovations in religion, I have become your disciple. You, Meletus, as I shall say to him, acknowledge Euthyphro to be a great theologian, and sound in his opinions; and if you approve of him you ought to approve of me, and not have me into court; but if you disapprove, you should begin by indicting him who is my teacher, and who will be the ruin, not of the young, but of the old; that is to say, of myself whom he instructs, and of his old father whom he admonishes and chastises. And if Meletus refuses to listen to me, but will go on, and will not shift the indictment from me to you, I cannot do better than repeat this challenge in the court.
SOCRATES: Dear friend! I believe the best thing I can do is to become your student. So before my trial with Meletus, I’ll confront him and say that I’ve always been deeply interested in religious issues, and now, since he accuses me of reckless ideas and changes in religion, I’ve become your student. You, Meletus, as I will tell him, recognize Euthyphro as a brilliant theologian with solid views; if you support him, you should also support me and not bring me to court. But if you disagree with him, then you should start by suing my teacher, who will actually harm not the youth but the older ones—that is, myself whom he teaches, and his elderly father whom he advises and disciplines. And if Meletus refuses to listen to me and insists on not shifting the indictment from me to you, I’ll have no choice but to repeat this challenge in court.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, indeed, Socrates; and if he attempts to indict me I am mistaken if I do not find a flaw in him; the court shall have a great deal more to say to him than to me.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, definitely, Socrates; and if he tries to accuse me, I’m sure I’ll be able to find a flaw in him; the court will have much more to discuss with him than with me.
SOCRATES: And I, my dear friend, knowing this, am desirous of becoming your disciple. For I observe that no one appears to notice you—not even this Meletus; but his sharp eyes have found me out at once, and he has indicted me for impiety. And therefore, I adjure you to tell me the nature of piety and impiety, which you said that you knew so well, and of murder, and of other offences against the gods. What are they? Is not piety in every action always the same? and impiety, again—is it not always the opposite of piety, and also the same with itself, having, as impiety, one notion which includes whatever is impious?
SOCRATES: And I, my dear friend, knowing this, want to become your student. I see that no one seems to pay attention to you—not even this Meletus; but his sharp eyes have spotted me right away, and he’s charged me with disrespecting the gods. So, I urge you to explain the nature of piety and impiety, which you said you understood so well, as well as murder and other offenses against the gods. What are they? Isn’t piety in every action always the same? And as for impiety, isn’t it always the opposite of piety and consistently the same thing, having one definition that includes everything considered impious?
EUTHYPHRO: To be sure, Socrates.
EUTHYPHRO: For sure, Socrates.
SOCRATES: And what is piety, and what is impiety?
SOCRATES: So, what exactly is piety, and what does impiety mean?
EUTHYPHRO: Piety is doing as I am doing; that is to say, prosecuting any one who is guilty of murder, sacrilege, or of any similar crime—whether he be your father or mother, or whoever he may be—that makes no difference; and not to prosecute them is impiety. And please to consider, Socrates, what a notable proof I will give you of the truth of my words, a proof which I have already given to others:—of the principle, I mean, that the impious, whoever he may be, ought not to go unpunished. For do not men regard Zeus as the best and most righteous of the gods?—and yet they admit that he bound his father (Cronos) because he wickedly devoured his sons, and that he too had punished his own father (Uranus) for a similar reason, in a nameless manner. And yet when I proceed against my father, they are angry with me. So inconsistent are they in their way of talking when the gods are concerned, and when I am concerned.
EUTHYPHRO: Piety is doing what I'm doing; that is to say, prosecuting anyone who is guilty of murder, sacrilege, or any similar crime—whether it's your father, mother, or anyone else—it makes no difference; and not prosecuting them is impiety. And consider, Socrates, what a strong proof I will give you of the truth of my words, a proof I've already shared with others:—of the principle that the impious, whoever they are, shouldn't go unpunished. For don't people consider Zeus the best and most just of the gods?—and yet they acknowledge that he bound his father (Cronos) for wickedly devouring his sons, and that he also punished his own father (Uranus) for a similar reason, in a way that's not specified. And yet when I take action against my father, they get angry with me. How inconsistent they are in their opinions when it comes to the gods versus when it comes to me.
SOCRATES: May not this be the reason, Euthyphro, why I am charged with impiety—that I cannot away with these stories about the gods? and therefore I suppose that people think me wrong. But, as you who are well informed about them approve of them, I cannot do better than assent to your superior wisdom. What else can I say, confessing as I do, that I know nothing about them? Tell me, for the love of Zeus, whether you really believe that they are true.
SOCRATES: Could this be why people accuse me of being impious, Euthyphro? Maybe they think I can't accept these stories about the gods, and that's why they see me as wrong. But since you, who know so much about these things, approve of them, I guess I should agree with your greater wisdom. What else can I say, especially since I admit I don't know anything about them? Please tell me, for the love of Zeus, do you actually believe they are true?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates; and things more wonderful still, of which the world is in ignorance.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates; and even more amazing things that the world doesn't know about.
SOCRATES: And do you really believe that the gods fought with one another, and had dire quarrels, battles, and the like, as the poets say, and as you may see represented in the works of great artists? The temples are full of them; and notably the robe of Athene, which is carried up to the Acropolis at the great Panathenaea, is embroidered with them. Are all these tales of the gods true, Euthyphro?
SOCRATES: Do you actually think that the gods fought with each other and had intense arguments, battles, and all that, like the poets say and as you can see depicted in the works of great artists? The temples are full of them; especially the robe of Athena, which is taken up to the Acropolis during the big Panathenaea, is embroidered with these scenes. Are all these stories about the gods true, Euthyphro?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates; and, as I was saying, I can tell you, if you would like to hear them, many other things about the gods which would quite amaze you.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates; and, as I was saying, I can tell you, if you're interested, many other things about the gods that would really surprise you.
SOCRATES: I dare say; and you shall tell me them at some other time when I have leisure. But just at present I would rather hear from you a more precise answer, which you have not as yet given, my friend, to the question, What is 'piety'? When asked, you only replied, Doing as you do, charging your father with murder.
SOCRATES: I believe so; and you can tell me more about it another time when I have some free time. But right now, I'd prefer a more straightforward answer, which you haven't given yet, my friend. The question is, what is 'piety'? When I asked, you only responded by saying it's about doing what you do, accusing your father of murder.
EUTHYPHRO: And what I said was true, Socrates.
EUTHYPHRO: What I said was true, Socrates.
SOCRATES: No doubt, Euthyphro; but you would admit that there are many other pious acts?
SOCRATES: No doubt, Euthyphro; but you would agree that there are many other pious actions?
EUTHYPHRO: There are.
EUTHYPHRO: There are.
SOCRATES: Remember that I did not ask you to give me two or three examples of piety, but to explain the general idea which makes all pious things to be pious. Do you not recollect that there was one idea which made the impious impious, and the pious pious?
SOCRATES: Remember, I didn’t ask you for two or three examples of piety, but to explain the overall concept that defines what makes things pious. Don’t you recall that there was one idea that made the impious impious and the pious pious?
EUTHYPHRO: I remember.
EUTHYPHRO: I recall.
SOCRATES: Tell me what is the nature of this idea, and then I shall have a standard to which I may look, and by which I may measure actions, whether yours or those of any one else, and then I shall be able to say that such and such an action is pious, such another impious.
SOCRATES: Explain what this idea really is, and then I’ll have a standard to refer to and use to evaluate actions—whether yours or anyone else's. That way, I can determine which actions are pious and which ones are not.
EUTHYPHRO: I will tell you, if you like.
EUTHYPHRO: I can tell you, if you want.
SOCRATES: I should very much like.
SOCRATES: I would really like that.
EUTHYPHRO: Piety, then, is that which is dear to the gods, and impiety is that which is not dear to them.
EUTHYPHRO: So, piety is what the gods love, and impiety is what they don’t love.
SOCRATES: Very good, Euthyphro; you have now given me the sort of answer which I wanted. But whether what you say is true or not I cannot as yet tell, although I make no doubt that you will prove the truth of your words.
SOCRATES: That's great, Euthyphro; you’ve given me the kind of answer I was looking for. However, I can't say yet whether what you’re saying is true, although I have no doubt that you’ll be able to prove your point.
EUTHYPHRO: Of course.
Absolutely.
SOCRATES: Come, then, and let us examine what we are saying. That thing or person which is dear to the gods is pious, and that thing or person which is hateful to the gods is impious, these two being the extreme opposites of one another. Was not that said?
SOCRATES: Alright, let’s take a close look at what we’re discussing. Anything or anyone that is loved by the gods is pious, and anything or anyone that is hated by the gods is impious—these two are complete opposites, right? Was that stated?
EUTHYPHRO: It was.
EUTHYPHRO: It was.
SOCRATES: And well said?
SOCRATES: And well said?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates, I thought so; it was certainly said.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah, Socrates, I figured that; it was definitely mentioned.
SOCRATES: And further, Euthyphro, the gods were admitted to have enmities and hatreds and differences?
SOCRATES: And furthermore, Euthyphro, the gods are acknowledged to have conflicts, grudges, and disagreements?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, that was also said.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah, that was mentioned too.
SOCRATES: And what sort of difference creates enmity and anger? Suppose for example that you and I, my good friend, differ about a number; do differences of this sort make us enemies and set us at variance with one another? Do we not go at once to arithmetic, and put an end to them by a sum?
SOCRATES: So, what kind of differences lead to hostility and anger? For instance, if you and I, my good friend, disagree about a number, do such differences turn us into enemies and cause conflict between us? Don’t we just go to arithmetic and resolve it with a simple calculation?
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: Exactly.
SOCRATES: Or suppose that we differ about magnitudes, do we not quickly end the differences by measuring?
SOCRATES: Or let's say we disagree about sizes, don’t we quickly resolve those differences by measuring?
EUTHYPHRO: Very true.
EUTHYPHRO: Absolutely.
SOCRATES: And we end a controversy about heavy and light by resorting to a weighing machine?
SOCRATES: So, are we settling a debate about heavy and light by using a weighing scale?
EUTHYPHRO: To be sure.
EUTHYPHRO: For sure.
SOCRATES: But what differences are there which cannot be thus decided, and which therefore make us angry and set us at enmity with one another? I dare say the answer does not occur to you at the moment, and therefore I will suggest that these enmities arise when the matters of difference are the just and unjust, good and evil, honourable and dishonourable. Are not these the points about which men differ, and about which when we are unable satisfactorily to decide our differences, you and I and all of us quarrel, when we do quarrel? (Compare Alcib.)
SOCRATES: But what differences are there that can't be settled this way, which cause us to become angry and turn against each other? I bet you can’t think of the answer right now, so I’ll suggest that these conflicts arise when the issues at stake involve justice and injustice, good and evil, honorable and dishonorable actions. Aren't these the topics that people argue about, and isn’t it true that when we can't decide on these differences satisfactorily, that’s when you, me, and everyone else ends up in conflict? (Compare Alcib.)
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates, the nature of the differences about which we quarrel is such as you describe.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates, the nature of the differences we argue about is just as you described.
SOCRATES: And the quarrels of the gods, noble Euthyphro, when they occur, are of a like nature?
SOCRATES: So, the conflicts among the gods, noble Euthyphro, when they happen, are similar in nature?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly they are.
EUTHYPHRO: Of course they are.
SOCRATES: They have differences of opinion, as you say, about good and evil, just and unjust, honourable and dishonourable: there would have been no quarrels among them, if there had been no such differences—would there now?
SOCRATES: They have different opinions, as you mentioned, about good and evil, just and unjust, honorable and dishonorable: there wouldn't be any arguments among them if there weren't these differences—right?
EUTHYPHRO: You are quite right.
EUTHYPHRO: You're absolutely right.
SOCRATES: Does not every man love that which he deems noble and just and good, and hate the opposite of them?
SOCRATES: Doesn’t every person love what they see as noble, just, and good, and hate the opposite?
EUTHYPHRO: Very true.
EUTHYPHRO: Absolutely.
SOCRATES: But, as you say, people regard the same things, some as just and others as unjust,—about these they dispute; and so there arise wars and fightings among them.
SOCRATES: But, as you said, people see the same things, some as fair and others as unfair—this is what they argue about; and because of this, wars and conflicts emerge among them.
EUTHYPHRO: Very true.
EUTHYPHRO: So true.
SOCRATES: Then the same things are hated by the gods and loved by the gods, and are both hateful and dear to them?
SOCRATES: So the same things are both hated and loved by the gods, and are both things they despise and cherish?
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: And upon this view the same things, Euthyphro, will be pious and also impious?
SOCRATES: So based on this perspective, Euthyphro, can the same things be both pious and impious?
EUTHYPHRO: So I should suppose.
EUTHYPHRO: I guess that's true.
SOCRATES: Then, my friend, I remark with surprise that you have not answered the question which I asked. For I certainly did not ask you to tell me what action is both pious and impious: but now it would seem that what is loved by the gods is also hated by them. And therefore, Euthyphro, in thus chastising your father you may very likely be doing what is agreeable to Zeus but disagreeable to Cronos or Uranus, and what is acceptable to Hephaestus but unacceptable to Here, and there may be other gods who have similar differences of opinion.
SOCRATES: So, my friend, I'm surprised that you haven't answered the question I asked. I definitely didn't ask you to explain what actions can be both pious and impious. But it seems that what the gods love is also something they hate. So, Euthyphro, by punishing your father, you might be doing something that pleases Zeus but upsets Cronos or Uranus, and what Hephaestus finds acceptable might be unacceptable to Hera, and there could be other gods with similar disagreements.
EUTHYPHRO: But I believe, Socrates, that all the gods would be agreed as to the propriety of punishing a murderer: there would be no difference of opinion about that.
EUTHYPHRO: But I think, Socrates, that all the gods would agree that punishing a murderer is the right thing to do; there wouldn’t be any disagreement about that.
SOCRATES: Well, but speaking of men, Euthyphro, did you ever hear any one arguing that a murderer or any sort of evil-doer ought to be let off?
SOCRATES: Well, speaking of people, Euthyphro, have you ever heard anyone argue that a murderer or any kind of wrongdoer should be let go?
EUTHYPHRO: I should rather say that these are the questions which they are always arguing, especially in courts of law: they commit all sorts of crimes, and there is nothing which they will not do or say in their own defence.
EUTHYPHRO: I should say that these are the questions they always debate, especially in court: they commit all sorts of crimes, and there is nothing they won't do or say to defend themselves.
SOCRATES: But do they admit their guilt, Euthyphro, and yet say that they ought not to be punished?
SOCRATES: But do they acknowledge their guilt, Euthyphro, and still say that they shouldn’t be punished?
EUTHYPHRO: No; they do not.
EUTHYPHRO: Nope; they don't.
SOCRATES: Then there are some things which they do not venture to say and do: for they do not venture to argue that the guilty are to be unpunished, but they deny their guilt, do they not?
SOCRATES: So there are some things that they won't admit to saying and doing; they don't dare to argue that the guilty should go unpunished, but they deny their guilt, right?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: Then they do not argue that the evil-doer should not be punished, but they argue about the fact of who the evil-doer is, and what he did and when?
SOCRATES: So they’re not saying that the wrongdoer shouldn’t be punished, but they’re debating who the wrongdoer is, what he did, and when?
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: For sure.
SOCRATES: And the gods are in the same case, if as you assert they quarrel about just and unjust, and some of them say while others deny that injustice is done among them. For surely neither God nor man will ever venture to say that the doer of injustice is not to be punished?
SOCRATES: The same goes for the gods. If, as you claim, they argue about what is just and unjust, with some saying that injustice occurs while others deny it, then it's clear that neither God nor man would ever claim that someone who commits injustice shouldn't be punished.
EUTHYPHRO: That is true, Socrates, in the main.
EUTHYPHRO: That's mostly right, Socrates.
SOCRATES: But they join issue about the particulars—gods and men alike; and, if they dispute at all, they dispute about some act which is called in question, and which by some is affirmed to be just, by others to be unjust. Is not that true?
SOCRATES: But they disagree on the details—gods and people alike; and, if they argue at all, they argue about some action that’s being questioned, which some claim is just, while others claim it’s unjust. Isn't that right?
EUTHYPHRO: Quite true.
EUTHYPHRO: That's right.
SOCRATES: Well then, my dear friend Euthyphro, do tell me, for my better instruction and information, what proof have you that in the opinion of all the gods a servant who is guilty of murder, and is put in chains by the master of the dead man, and dies because he is put in chains before he who bound him can learn from the interpreters of the gods what he ought to do with him, dies unjustly; and that on behalf of such an one a son ought to proceed against his father and accuse him of murder. How would you show that all the gods absolutely agree in approving of his act? Prove to me that they do, and I will applaud your wisdom as long as I live.
SOCRATES: So, my dear friend Euthyphro, please enlighten me for my understanding. What evidence do you have that, in the eyes of all the gods, a servant who commits murder and is chained by the master of the dead person—who then dies in captivity before his captor can consult the divine interpreters on what to do—dies unjustly? And how can you argue that a son should take legal action against his father for murder on behalf of such a person? Show me how all the gods completely agree that this is the right thing to do. Prove it to me, and I'll praise your wisdom for the rest of my life.
EUTHYPHRO: It will be a difficult task; but I could make the matter very clear indeed to you.
EUTHYPHRO: It’s going to be tough, but I can definitely make it clear for you.
SOCRATES: I understand; you mean to say that I am not so quick of apprehension as the judges: for to them you will be sure to prove that the act is unjust, and hateful to the gods.
SOCRATES: I get it; you’re saying that I’m not as quick to understand as the judges are. You’re confident that you can show them the act is unjust and disliked by the gods.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes indeed, Socrates; at least if they will listen to me.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, definitely, Socrates; at least if they are willing to listen to me.
SOCRATES: But they will be sure to listen if they find that you are a good speaker. There was a notion that came into my mind while you were speaking; I said to myself: 'Well, and what if Euthyphro does prove to me that all the gods regarded the death of the serf as unjust, how do I know anything more of the nature of piety and impiety? for granting that this action may be hateful to the gods, still piety and impiety are not adequately defined by these distinctions, for that which is hateful to the gods has been shown to be also pleasing and dear to them.' And therefore, Euthyphro, I do not ask you to prove this; I will suppose, if you like, that all the gods condemn and abominate such an action. But I will amend the definition so far as to say that what all the gods hate is impious, and what they love pious or holy; and what some of them love and others hate is both or neither. Shall this be our definition of piety and impiety?
SOCRATES: But they will definitely listen if they see you’re a good speaker. While you were talking, I had a thought; I said to myself, 'Well, even if Euthyphro manages to show me that all the gods consider the death of the servant unjust, how do I know anything more about the nature of piety and impiety? Because even if this action might be detestable to the gods, piety and impiety can’t be fully explained by these differences, since what is hateful to the gods has also been shown to be pleasing and dear to them.' So, Euthyphro, I’m not asking you to prove this; I’ll assume, if that works for you, that all the gods condemn and despise such an action. But I’d like to rephrase the definition a bit to say that what all the gods hate is impious, and what they love is pious or holy; and what some of them love and others hate is both or neither. Should this be our definition of piety and impiety?
EUTHYPHRO: Why not, Socrates?
EUTHYPHRO: Why not, Socrates?
SOCRATES: Why not! certainly, as far as I am concerned, Euthyphro, there is no reason why not. But whether this admission will greatly assist you in the task of instructing me as you promised, is a matter for you to consider.
SOCRATES: Why not! As far as I’m concerned, Euthyphro, there’s no reason not to. But whether this admission will actually help you teach me as you promised is something for you to think about.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, I should say that what all the gods love is pious and holy, and the opposite which they all hate, impious.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, I would say that what all the gods love is respectful and holy, and what they all hate is disrespectful.
SOCRATES: Ought we to enquire into the truth of this, Euthyphro, or simply to accept the mere statement on our own authority and that of others? What do you say?
SOCRATES: Should we look into the truth of this, Euthyphro, or just accept what's said based on our own authority and that of others? What do you think?
EUTHYPHRO: We should enquire; and I believe that the statement will stand the test of enquiry.
EUTHYPHRO: We should ask, and I think that the statement will hold up under scrutiny.
SOCRATES: We shall know better, my good friend, in a little while. The point which I should first wish to understand is whether the pious or holy is beloved by the gods because it is holy, or holy because it is beloved of the gods.
SOCRATES: We'll understand better soon, my good friend. What I first want to get clear on is whether something is loved by the gods because it's holy, or if it's holy because the gods love it.
EUTHYPHRO: I do not understand your meaning, Socrates.
EUTHYPHRO: I don’t get what you mean, Socrates.
SOCRATES: I will endeavour to explain: we, speak of carrying and we speak of being carried, of leading and being led, seeing and being seen. You know that in all such cases there is a difference, and you know also in what the difference lies?
SOCRATES: I will try to explain: we talk about carrying and being carried, leading and being led, seeing and being seen. You know that there is a difference in all these cases, and you also understand what that difference is?
EUTHYPHRO: I think that I understand.
EUTHYPHRO: I think I get it.
SOCRATES: And is not that which is beloved distinct from that which loves?
SOCRATES: Isn't what is loved different from what loves?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly.
EUTHYPHRO: Sure.
SOCRATES: Well; and now tell me, is that which is carried in this state of carrying because it is carried, or for some other reason?
SOCRATES: Alright; now tell me, is what is being carried in this state of carrying because it is being carried, or is there some other reason?
EUTHYPHRO: No; that is the reason.
EUTHYPHRO: No, that's why.
SOCRATES: And the same is true of what is led and of what is seen?
SOCRATES: Is the same true for what is guided and for what is observed?
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: Right.
SOCRATES: And a thing is not seen because it is visible, but conversely, visible because it is seen; nor is a thing led because it is in the state of being led, or carried because it is in the state of being carried, but the converse of this. And now I think, Euthyphro, that my meaning will be intelligible; and my meaning is, that any state of action or passion implies previous action or passion. It does not become because it is becoming, but it is in a state of becoming because it becomes; neither does it suffer because it is in a state of suffering, but it is in a state of suffering because it suffers. Do you not agree?
SOCRATES: A thing isn’t seen just because it’s visible; rather, it’s visible because it’s seen. Similarly, a thing isn’t led just because it’s in the process of being led, or carried just because it’s in the process of being carried; the opposite is true. I believe, Euthyphro, that my point will now be clear. What I mean is that any state of action or experience relies on previous action or experience. It doesn’t become just because it’s becoming; it’s in a state of becoming because it actually becomes. Likewise, it doesn’t suffer just because it’s in a state of suffering; it’s in a state of suffering because it suffers. Don’t you agree?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yep.
SOCRATES: Is not that which is loved in some state either of becoming or suffering?
SOCRATES: Isn't that which is loved always in a state of either becoming or suffering?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: And the same holds as in the previous instances; the state of being loved follows the act of being loved, and not the act the state.
SOCRATES: The same is true as in the earlier examples; being in a state of being loved comes after the action of loving, not the other way around.
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly.
EUTHYPHRO: Of course.
SOCRATES: And what do you say of piety, Euthyphro: is not piety, according to your definition, loved by all the gods?
SOCRATES: So, what do you think about piety, Euthyphro? Isn't piety, based on your definition, something that all the gods love?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: Because it is pious or holy, or for some other reason?
SOCRATES: Is it because it’s pious or holy, or is there another reason?
EUTHYPHRO: No, that is the reason.
EUTHYPHRO: No, that’s why.
SOCRATES: It is loved because it is holy, not holy because it is loved?
SOCRATES: It's loved because it's holy, not holy because it's loved?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
Euthyphro: Yeah.
SOCRATES: And that which is dear to the gods is loved by them, and is in a state to be loved of them because it is loved of them?
SOCRATES: So, what the gods cherish is loved by them, and it's capable of being loved by them because they love it?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly.
EUTHYPHRO: Absolutely.
SOCRATES: Then that which is dear to the gods, Euthyphro, is not holy, nor is that which is holy loved of God, as you affirm; but they are two different things.
SOCRATES: So what is dear to the gods, Euthyphro, is not holy, nor is what is holy loved by God, as you claim; they are two different things.
EUTHYPHRO: How do you mean, Socrates?
EUTHYPHRO: What do you mean, Socrates?
SOCRATES: I mean to say that the holy has been acknowledged by us to be loved of God because it is holy, not to be holy because it is loved.
SOCRATES: What I mean is that we recognize something as holy because it is loved by God, not that it becomes holy because it is loved.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
Euthyphro: Yup.
SOCRATES: But that which is dear to the gods is dear to them because it is loved by them, not loved by them because it is dear to them.
SOCRATES: But what is cherished by the gods is cherished by them because they love it, not loved by them because it is cherished by them.
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: Right.
SOCRATES: But, friend Euthyphro, if that which is holy is the same with that which is dear to God, and is loved because it is holy, then that which is dear to God would have been loved as being dear to God; but if that which is dear to God is dear to him because loved by him, then that which is holy would have been holy because loved by him. But now you see that the reverse is the case, and that they are quite different from one another. For one (theophiles) is of a kind to be loved cause it is loved, and the other (osion) is loved because it is of a kind to be loved. Thus you appear to me, Euthyphro, when I ask you what is the essence of holiness, to offer an attribute only, and not the essence—the attribute of being loved by all the gods. But you still refuse to explain to me the nature of holiness. And therefore, if you please, I will ask you not to hide your treasure, but to tell me once more what holiness or piety really is, whether dear to the gods or not (for that is a matter about which we will not quarrel); and what is impiety?
SOCRATES: But, my friend Euthyphro, if what is holy is the same as what is loved by God, and it's loved because it's holy, then what is loved by God would be loved just for being loved by God. But if what is loved by God is loved because He loves it, then what is holy would only be holy because He loves it. However, you can see that the opposite is true, and that they are quite different from each other. One (theophiles) is something that is loved because it is loved, and the other (osion) is loved because it has qualities that make it lovable. So when I ask you what holiness really is, it seems to me, Euthyphro, that you're only providing an attribute and not the essence—the attribute of being loved by all the gods. Yet you still refuse to explain to me what holiness is. Therefore, if you don't mind, I would like to ask you not to keep your treasure hidden, but to tell me again what holiness or piety truly is, whether it’s dear to the gods or not (since that’s not something we need to argue about); and what is impiety?
EUTHYPHRO: I really do not know, Socrates, how to express what I mean. For somehow or other our arguments, on whatever ground we rest them, seem to turn round and walk away from us.
EUTHYPHRO: I honestly don’t know, Socrates, how to say what I mean. It’s like our arguments, no matter what we base them on, just end up drifting away from us.
SOCRATES: Your words, Euthyphro, are like the handiwork of my ancestor Daedalus; and if I were the sayer or propounder of them, you might say that my arguments walk away and will not remain fixed where they are placed because I am a descendant of his. But now, since these notions are your own, you must find some other gibe, for they certainly, as you yourself allow, show an inclination to be on the move.
SOCRATES: Your words, Euthyphro, are like the creations of my ancestor Daedalus; and if I were the one saying or proposing them, you could say my arguments just wander off and don't stick around where they're supposed to because I'm related to him. But now, since these ideas are yours, you need to find another jab, because they definitely, as you admit, seem to want to be on the move.
EUTHYPHRO: Nay, Socrates, I shall still say that you are the Daedalus who sets arguments in motion; not I, certainly, but you make them move or go round, for they would never have stirred, as far as I am concerned.
EUTHYPHRO: No, Socrates, I still say that you are like Daedalus, who gets arguments moving; it’s not me, for sure, but you are the one who makes them move or go in circles, because they would never have budged as far as I’m concerned.
SOCRATES: Then I must be a greater than Daedalus: for whereas he only made his own inventions to move, I move those of other people as well. And the beauty of it is, that I would rather not. For I would give the wisdom of Daedalus, and the wealth of Tantalus, to be able to detain them and keep them fixed. But enough of this. As I perceive that you are lazy, I will myself endeavour to show you how you might instruct me in the nature of piety; and I hope that you will not grudge your labour. Tell me, then—Is not that which is pious necessarily just?
SOCRATES: Then I must be greater than Daedalus: because while he only created his own inventions to move, I can influence the creations of others too. And the best part is, I’d actually prefer not to do this. I would trade the wisdom of Daedalus and the riches of Tantalus just to keep them still and grounded. But enough of that. Since I see that you aren't very motivated, I will try to show you how you might teach me about the true nature of piety; and I hope you won’t mind putting in the effort. So tell me—Isn’t that which is pious always just?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: And is, then, all which is just pious? or, is that which is pious all just, but that which is just, only in part and not all, pious?
SOCRATES: So, is everything that is just also pious? Or is everything that is pious just, but not everything that is just is fully pious?
EUTHYPHRO: I do not understand you, Socrates.
EUTHYPHRO: I don't get you, Socrates.
SOCRATES: And yet I know that you are as much wiser than I am, as you are younger. But, as I was saying, revered friend, the abundance of your wisdom makes you lazy. Please to exert yourself, for there is no real difficulty in understanding me. What I mean I may explain by an illustration of what I do not mean. The poet (Stasinus) sings—
SOCRATES: And yet I know you’re wiser than I am, just like you’re younger. But, as I was saying, dear friend, your vast wisdom makes you complacent. Please make an effort, as there’s no real challenge in understanding me. I can clarify what I mean by using an example of what I don’t mean. The poet (Stasinus) sings—
'Of Zeus, the author and creator of all these things, You will not tell: for where there is fear there is also reverence.'
'You won't speak of Zeus, the author and creator of all these things: for where there is fear, there is also respect.'
Now I disagree with this poet. Shall I tell you in what respect?
Now I disagree with this poet. Should I tell you why?
EUTHYPHRO: By all means.
EUTHYPHRO: Of course.
SOCRATES: I should not say that where there is fear there is also reverence; for I am sure that many persons fear poverty and disease, and the like evils, but I do not perceive that they reverence the objects of their fear.
SOCRATES: I wouldn't say that where there's fear, there's also respect; because I know that many people fear poverty and illness, and similar troubles, but I don't see that they actually respect the things they fear.
EUTHYPHRO: Very true.
EUTHYPHRO: So true.
SOCRATES: But where reverence is, there is fear; for he who has a feeling of reverence and shame about the commission of any action, fears and is afraid of an ill reputation.
SOCRATES: But where there is respect, there is fear; for someone who feels respect and shame about doing something, fears and is worried about a bad reputation.
EUTHYPHRO: No doubt.
Definitely.
SOCRATES: Then we are wrong in saying that where there is fear there is also reverence; and we should say, where there is reverence there is also fear. But there is not always reverence where there is fear; for fear is a more extended notion, and reverence is a part of fear, just as the odd is a part of number, and number is a more extended notion than the odd. I suppose that you follow me now?
SOCRATES: So, we’re mistaken in saying that where there’s fear, there’s also reverence; instead, we should say that where there’s reverence, there’s also fear. However, fear doesn’t always involve reverence; fear is a broader concept, and reverence is a subset of fear, just like odd numbers are a subset of all numbers, and numbers are a broader concept than odd numbers. Do you understand what I mean now?
EUTHYPHRO: Quite well.
EUTHYPHRO: Very well.
SOCRATES: That was the sort of question which I meant to raise when I asked whether the just is always the pious, or the pious always the just; and whether there may not be justice where there is not piety; for justice is the more extended notion of which piety is only a part. Do you dissent?
SOCRATES: That was the kind of question I wanted to bring up when I asked whether what is just is always what is pious, or if what is pious is always what is just; and whether there can be justice without piety, since justice is the broader concept of which piety is just a part. Do you disagree?
EUTHYPHRO: No, I think that you are quite right.
EUTHYPHRO: No, I think you're absolutely right.
SOCRATES: Then, if piety is a part of justice, I suppose that we should enquire what part? If you had pursued the enquiry in the previous cases; for instance, if you had asked me what is an even number, and what part of number the even is, I should have had no difficulty in replying, a number which represents a figure having two equal sides. Do you not agree?
SOCRATES: So, if piety is a part of justice, I guess we should find out which part? If you had looked into this in the previous cases; for example, if you had asked me what an even number is and what part of numbers even numbers represent, I would have easily replied that it’s a number that shows a figure with two equal sides. Don't you think?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, I quite agree.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, I totally agree.
SOCRATES: In like manner, I want you to tell me what part of justice is piety or holiness, that I may be able to tell Meletus not to do me injustice, or indict me for impiety, as I am now adequately instructed by you in the nature of piety or holiness, and their opposites.
SOCRATES: Similarly, I want you to explain to me what aspect of justice is related to piety or holiness, so I can inform Meletus not to treat me unfairly or accuse me of impiety, since I have now been properly educated by you on the essence of piety or holiness and their opposites.
EUTHYPHRO: Piety or holiness, Socrates, appears to me to be that part of justice which attends to the gods, as there is the other part of justice which attends to men.
EUTHYPHRO: Piety or holiness, Socrates, seems to me to be that aspect of justice that relates to the gods, while there is another aspect of justice that relates to humans.
SOCRATES: That is good, Euthyphro; yet still there is a little point about which I should like to have further information, What is the meaning of 'attention'? For attention can hardly be used in the same sense when applied to the gods as when applied to other things. For instance, horses are said to require attention, and not every person is able to attend to them, but only a person skilled in horsemanship. Is it not so?
SOCRATES: That's good, Euthyphro; but there's one more thing I'd like to clarify. What does 'attention' really mean? Because the term can't mean the exact same thing when we talk about the gods as it does when we discuss other things. For example, horses are said to need attention, but not just anyone can provide it—only someone who knows how to handle them. Isn't that right?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly.
Sure.
SOCRATES: I should suppose that the art of horsemanship is the art of attending to horses?
SOCRATES: I guess that the skill of horsemanship is all about taking care of horses?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: Nor is every one qualified to attend to dogs, but only the huntsman?
SOCRATES: Not everyone is qualified to take care of dogs, only the huntsman?
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: That's right.
SOCRATES: And I should also conceive that the art of the huntsman is the art of attending to dogs?
SOCRATES: So, I should also believe that being a huntsman means taking care of dogs?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
Euthyphro: Yeah.
SOCRATES: As the art of the oxherd is the art of attending to oxen?
SOCRATES: Is the skill of the cattle herder just about taking care of cattle?
EUTHYPHRO: Very true.
EUTHYPHRO: That's right.
SOCRATES: In like manner holiness or piety is the art of attending to the gods?—that would be your meaning, Euthyphro?
SOCRATES: So, holiness or piety is the skill of serving the gods, right? That’s what you mean, Euthyphro?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah.
SOCRATES: And is not attention always designed for the good or benefit of that to which the attention is given? As in the case of horses, you may observe that when attended to by the horseman's art they are benefited and improved, are they not?
SOCRATES: Isn't attention always aimed at benefiting the thing to which we direct our focus? Just like with horses, you can see that when they are cared for with the horseman's skill, they are helped and improved, right?
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: That's right.
SOCRATES: As the dogs are benefited by the huntsman's art, and the oxen by the art of the oxherd, and all other things are tended or attended for their good and not for their hurt?
SOCRATES: Just like dogs benefit from the huntsman's skills, and oxen from the herder's expertise, everything else is cared for or attended to for their benefit, not their harm?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly, not for their hurt.
EUTHYPHRO: Definitely, not to harm them.
SOCRATES: But for their good?
SOCRATES: But for their benefit?
EUTHYPHRO: Of course.
EUTHYPHRO: Definitely.
SOCRATES: And does piety or holiness, which has been defined to be the art of attending to the gods, benefit or improve them? Would you say that when you do a holy act you make any of the gods better?
SOCRATES: So, does piety or holiness, which we've defined as the practice of serving the gods, actually benefit or improve them? Would you say that when you perform a holy act, you make any of the gods better?
EUTHYPHRO: No, no; that was certainly not what I meant.
EUTHYPHRO: No, no; that’s definitely not what I meant.
SOCRATES: And I, Euthyphro, never supposed that you did. I asked you the question about the nature of the attention, because I thought that you did not.
SOCRATES: And I, Euthyphro, never thought you did. I asked you about the nature of the attention because I believed you didn’t.
EUTHYPHRO: You do me justice, Socrates; that is not the sort of attention which I mean.
EUTHYPHRO: You’re being fair to me, Socrates; that’s not the kind of attention I’m talking about.
SOCRATES: Good: but I must still ask what is this attention to the gods which is called piety?
SOCRATES: Great, but I still need to ask, what is this focus on the gods that we refer to as piety?
EUTHYPHRO: It is such, Socrates, as servants show to their masters.
EUTHYPHRO: It's like what servants show to their bosses, Socrates.
SOCRATES: I understand—a sort of ministration to the gods.
SOCRATES: I get it—a kind of service to the gods.
EUTHYPHRO: Exactly.
EUTHYPHRO: Exactly.
SOCRATES: Medicine is also a sort of ministration or service, having in view the attainment of some object—would you not say of health?
SOCRATES: Medicine is also a form of service aimed at achieving a specific goal—would you agree it’s health?
EUTHYPHRO: I should.
I should.
SOCRATES: Again, there is an art which ministers to the ship-builder with a view to the attainment of some result?
SOCRATES: So, there's a skill that supports the shipbuilder to achieve a certain outcome?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates, with a view to the building of a ship.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates, with the goal of building a ship.
SOCRATES: As there is an art which ministers to the house-builder with a view to the building of a house?
SOCRATES: Just like there's a craft that helps the builder when it comes to constructing a house?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
EUTHYPHRO: Yes.
SOCRATES: And now tell me, my good friend, about the art which ministers to the gods: what work does that help to accomplish? For you must surely know if, as you say, you are of all men living the one who is best instructed in religion.
SOCRATES: So tell me, my good friend, about the art that serves the gods: what does that work help achieve? You must know, since you say you are the most knowledgeable person about religion among all living people.
EUTHYPHRO: And I speak the truth, Socrates.
EUTHYPHRO: And I’m telling the truth, Socrates.
SOCRATES: Tell me then, oh tell me—what is that fair work which the gods do by the help of our ministrations?
SOCRATES: So tell me, please—what is that beautiful work the gods achieve with our help?
EUTHYPHRO: Many and fair, Socrates, are the works which they do.
EUTHYPHRO: There are many great things, Socrates, that they accomplish.
SOCRATES: Why, my friend, and so are those of a general. But the chief of them is easily told. Would you not say that victory in war is the chief of them?
SOCRATES: Well, my friend, the same goes for those of a general. But the main point is easy to explain. Wouldn’t you agree that winning a war is the most important of them all?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly.
EUTHYPHRO: Of course.
SOCRATES: Many and fair, too, are the works of the husbandman, if I am not mistaken; but his chief work is the production of food from the earth?
SOCRATES: There are many great things that a farmer does, if I'm not mistaken; but his main job is producing food from the land, right?
EUTHYPHRO: Exactly.
EUTHYPHRO: That's right.
SOCRATES: And of the many and fair things done by the gods, which is the chief or principal one?
SOCRATES: Among all the wonderful things created by the gods, which one is the most important?
EUTHYPHRO: I have told you already, Socrates, that to learn all these things accurately will be very tiresome. Let me simply say that piety or holiness is learning how to please the gods in word and deed, by prayers and sacrifices. Such piety is the salvation of families and states, just as the impious, which is unpleasing to the gods, is their ruin and destruction.
EUTHYPHRO: I’ve already mentioned, Socrates, that figuring all this out accurately is going to be really exhausting. So, let me just put it this way: piety or holiness is about knowing how to please the gods through our words and actions, especially through prayers and sacrifices. This kind of piety brings salvation to families and communities, while being impious, which doesn’t please the gods, leads to their ruin and destruction.
SOCRATES: I think that you could have answered in much fewer words the chief question which I asked, Euthyphro, if you had chosen. But I see plainly that you are not disposed to instruct me—clearly not: else why, when we reached the point, did you turn aside? Had you only answered me I should have truly learned of you by this time the nature of piety. Now, as the asker of a question is necessarily dependent on the answerer, whither he leads I must follow; and can only ask again, what is the pious, and what is piety? Do you mean that they are a sort of science of praying and sacrificing?
SOCRATES: I think you could have answered my main question in a lot fewer words, Euthyphro, if you wanted to. But it’s clear you're not interested in teaching me—definitely not: otherwise, why did you change the subject when we got to the crucial point? If you had just answered me, I would have truly learned from you about the nature of piety by now. As the person asking the question, I have to follow where the answerer leads; so, I can only ask again, what is pious, and what is piety? Are you saying they are some sort of science of praying and sacrificing?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, I do.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah, I do.
SOCRATES: And sacrificing is giving to the gods, and prayer is asking of the gods?
SOCRATES: So, sacrificing is when we give to the gods, and praying is when we ask the gods?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, Socrates.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah, Socrates.
SOCRATES: Upon this view, then, piety is a science of asking and giving?
SOCRATES: So, from this perspective, piety is about the knowledge of asking and giving?
EUTHYPHRO: You understand me capitally, Socrates.
EUTHYPHRO: You understand me perfectly, Socrates.
SOCRATES: Yes, my friend; the reason is that I am a votary of your science, and give my mind to it, and therefore nothing which you say will be thrown away upon me. Please then to tell me, what is the nature of this service to the gods? Do you mean that we prefer requests and give gifts to them?
SOCRATES: Yes, my friend; the reason is that I'm dedicated to your field of study and fully engaged in it, so nothing you say will be wasted on me. So please, explain to me what this service to the gods is all about. Do you mean that we make requests and offer gifts to them?
EUTHYPHRO: Yes, I do.
EUTHYPHRO: Yeah, I do.
SOCRATES: Is not the right way of asking to ask of them what we want?
SOCRATES: Isn't the proper way to ask them what we want?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly.
EUTHYPHRO: Of course.
SOCRATES: And the right way of giving is to give to them in return what they want of us. There would be no meaning in an art which gives to any one that which he does not want.
SOCRATES: The correct way to give is to provide others with what they desire from us. It wouldn't make sense to practice an art that offers someone something they don't want.
EUTHYPHRO: Very true, Socrates.
Totally agree, Socrates.
SOCRATES: Then piety, Euthyphro, is an art which gods and men have of doing business with one another?
SOCRATES: So, Euthyphro, is piety a skill that gods and people have for dealing with each other?
EUTHYPHRO: That is an expression which you may use, if you like.
EUTHYPHRO: That's a phrase you can use if you want.
SOCRATES: But I have no particular liking for anything but the truth. I wish, however, that you would tell me what benefit accrues to the gods from our gifts. There is no doubt about what they give to us; for there is no good thing which they do not give; but how we can give any good thing to them in return is far from being equally clear. If they give everything and we give nothing, that must be an affair of business in which we have very greatly the advantage of them.
SOCRATES: I have no special interest in anything except the truth. However, I want to know what the gods gain from our offerings. It's clear what they provide us; they offer us everything good. But how we could possibly give them anything good in return is much less clear. If they give us everything and we give them nothing, it seems like we have a significant advantage in this arrangement.
EUTHYPHRO: And do you imagine, Socrates, that any benefit accrues to the gods from our gifts?
EUTHYPHRO: Do you really think, Socrates, that the gods gain anything from our offerings?
SOCRATES: But if not, Euthyphro, what is the meaning of gifts which are conferred by us upon the gods?
SOCRATES: But if that's not the case, Euthyphro, what do we mean when we talk about the gifts we offer to the gods?
EUTHYPHRO: What else, but tributes of honour; and, as I was just now saying, what pleases them?
EUTHYPHRO: What else but honors; and, as I just said, what makes them happy?
SOCRATES: Piety, then, is pleasing to the gods, but not beneficial or dear to them?
SOCRATES: So, piety is what pleases the gods, but it doesn't actually benefit them or matter to them?
EUTHYPHRO: I should say that nothing could be dearer.
EUTHYPHRO: I have to say that nothing could be more important.
SOCRATES: Then once more the assertion is repeated that piety is dear to the gods?
SOCRATES: So, once again, it's stated that piety is loved by the gods?
EUTHYPHRO: Certainly.
EUTHYPHRO: Of course.
SOCRATES: And when you say this, can you wonder at your words not standing firm, but walking away? Will you accuse me of being the Daedalus who makes them walk away, not perceiving that there is another and far greater artist than Daedalus who makes them go round in a circle, and he is yourself; for the argument, as you will perceive, comes round to the same point. Were we not saying that the holy or pious was not the same with that which is loved of the gods? Have you forgotten?
SOCRATES: When you say this, can you really be surprised that your words don’t hold up but instead just slip away? Are you going to blame me for being like Daedalus, who makes them wander off, without realizing there’s an even greater artist than Daedalus who makes them go in circles, and that’s you? Because, as you’ll notice, the argument comes back to the same point. Weren’t we saying that what is holy or pious isn’t the same as what the gods love? Have you forgotten?
EUTHYPHRO: I quite remember.
EUTHYPHRO: I remember clearly.
SOCRATES: And are you not saying that what is loved of the gods is holy; and is not this the same as what is dear to them—do you see?
SOCRATES: So you're saying that what's loved by the gods is holy; and isn't this the same as what they care about—do you get that?
EUTHYPHRO: True.
EUTHYPHRO: Right.
SOCRATES: Then either we were wrong in our former assertion; or, if we were right then, we are wrong now.
SOCRATES: So, either we were wrong in what we said before, or if we were right back then, we are wrong now.
EUTHYPHRO: One of the two must be true.
EUTHYPHRO: One of the two has to be true.
SOCRATES: Then we must begin again and ask, What is piety? That is an enquiry which I shall never be weary of pursuing as far as in me lies; and I entreat you not to scorn me, but to apply your mind to the utmost, and tell me the truth. For, if any man knows, you are he; and therefore I must detain you, like Proteus, until you tell. If you had not certainly known the nature of piety and impiety, I am confident that you would never, on behalf of a serf, have charged your aged father with murder. You would not have run such a risk of doing wrong in the sight of the gods, and you would have had too much respect for the opinions of men. I am sure, therefore, that you know the nature of piety and impiety. Speak out then, my dear Euthyphro, and do not hide your knowledge.
SOCRATES: So we need to start over and ask, What is piety? It's a question I’ll never tire of exploring as much as I can; and I ask you not to dismiss me, but to focus completely and share the truth. Because if anyone knows, it’s you; and so I have to keep you here, like Proteus, until you reveal it. If you really didn’t understand piety and impiety, I’m sure you wouldn’t have accused your elderly father of murder on behalf of a servant. You wouldn’t take such a risk of upsetting the gods, and you would have too much regard for what people think. So I’m convinced that you do know the distinction between piety and impiety. So speak up, my dear Euthyphro, and don’t hide what you know.
EUTHYPHRO: Another time, Socrates; for I am in a hurry, and must go now.
EUTHYPHRO: Another time, Socrates; I'm in a rush and have to go now.
SOCRATES: Alas! my companion, and will you leave me in despair? I was hoping that you would instruct me in the nature of piety and impiety; and then I might have cleared myself of Meletus and his indictment. I would have told him that I had been enlightened by Euthyphro, and had given up rash innovations and speculations, in which I indulged only through ignorance, and that now I am about to lead a better life.
SOCRATES: Oh no! My friend, will you really leave me in despair? I was hoping you would teach me about the nature of piety and impiety; then I could defend myself against Meletus and his charges. I could tell him that I've learned from Euthyphro, that I've stopped my reckless ideas and thoughts, which I only entertained because I didn’t know better, and that now I’m ready to live a better life.
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